# CNC12 v5.22 - Auto Squaring **URL:** \ **Category:** General Chat\ **Created:** [February 20, 2025, 8:24pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417 "2025-02-20T20:24:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![JtheB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b77776/32.png) [@JtheB](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/JtheB)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2025, 8:24pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/1 "2025-02-20T20:24:43Z")
The Wizard in v5.22 has clearly received an update and some welcome new features. Regarding the Homing and Travel \> Axes Pairing and Paired Axes Homing… Is this just an initial machine setup tool or should Auto Squaring be engaged? The associated pdf manual is watermarked as a draft. ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex027/user_avatar/forum.avidcnc.com/eric/32/3220_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2025, 8:45pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/2 "2025-02-20T20:45:19Z")
Are you using “our” version CNC12 or the one downloaded directly from Centroid? If you’re reading a manual that’s watermarked as a draft it sounds like you got that directly from Centroid ---
**Author:** ![JtheB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b77776/32.png) [@JtheB](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/JtheB)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2025, 9:20pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/3 "2025-02-20T21:20:09Z")
Yes, your version of cnc12. There’s a link to the manual in the Wizard. ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex027/user_avatar/forum.avidcnc.com/eric/32/3220_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2025, 9:56pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/4 "2025-02-20T21:56:50Z")
Ahh, that’s on the “advanced” side of the wizard. That link you found is to Centroid’s “stock” squaring setup. We don’t use that. On servos we use hard stop homing for squaring, and on steppers we use our own special homing script that handles squaring for you. Those are on by default. Did you have a particular need to go into that advanced menu for something that’s beyond the squaring we offer? ---
**Author:** ![JtheB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b77776/32.png) [@JtheB](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/JtheB)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2025, 10:23pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/5 "2025-02-20T22:23:58Z")
Gotcha. Had to adjust a bunch of things considering the update seems akin to building from scratch… inputs, outputs, all machine settings, Corbin’s atc stuff, etc. The MPU firmware gets updated when switching between a v5.18 and v.5.22 profile - this is expected, yes? ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex027/user_avatar/forum.avidcnc.com/eric/32/3220_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2025, 10:44pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/6 "2025-02-20T22:44:22Z")
If you’re using one of our machines when you setup from scratch you shouldn’t need to do anything in the advanced side save for maybe configuring the bar for Corbin’s scripts. Just trying to save you a headache 😉 As far as the firmware update that always happens when you switch major versions. ---
**Author:** ![JtheB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b77776/32.png) [@JtheB](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/JtheB)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2025, 11:17pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/7 "2025-02-20T23:17:13Z")
Roger that. Thanks Eric. ---
**Author:** ![rockstarsmurf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b487fb/32.png) [@rockstarsmurf](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/rockstarsmurf)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2025, 7:08am UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/8 "2025-03-30T07:08:19Z")
> [@Eric](#): > > Ahh, that’s on the “advanced” side of the wizard. That link you found is to Centroid’s “stock” squaring setup. We don’t use that. > > On servos we use hard stop homing for squaring, and on steppers we use our own special homing script that handles squaring for you. Those are on by default. > > Did you have a particular need to go into that advanced menu for something that’s beyond the squaring we offer? When you say “special” homing script for stepper based systems are you indicating that the system doesn’t use Acorn’s approch with a single relay to decouple the y axis along with slightly offseting the proximity sensors? Does this have anything to do with the additional relay on the interconnect board that isn’t shown in the schematics but is shown in a random picture? What is Avid’s method? If I was already in the process of retrofitting my own acorn board to my current MACH 4 control box like you did for your initial prototype but I only I only used the single relay for the auto squaring routine per Centroid’s instructions would that prohibit me from using AVID’s version of CNC 12.? ![image](https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/flex027/uploads/avidcnc/original/2X/a/a5a4f2a2cf9a8f80e51443e3149906c6db18b9b5.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex027/user_avatar/forum.avidcnc.com/eric/32/3220_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 2:49pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/9 "2025-03-31T14:49:01Z")
> [@rockstarsmurf](#): > > When you say “special” homing script for stepper based systems are you indicating that the system doesn’t use Acorn’s approch with a single relay to decouple the y axis along with slightly offseting the proximity sensors? Does this have anything to do with the additional relay on the interconnect board that isn’t shown in the schematics but is shown in a random picture? What is Avid’s method? If I was already in the process of retrofitting my own acorn board to my current MACH 4 control box like you did for your initial prototype but I only I only used the single relay for the auto squaring routine per Centroid’s instructions would that prohibit me from using AVID’s version of CNC 12.? We use the single relay method as well for squaring. We have a special homing script that differs from the Centroid stock one in a lot of ways. Not only does it do squaring, but it detects your machine type and will set different things (And home differently) depending on your machine settings. If you want to run our software on your retrofit you are welcome to do it, but for our software to work properly you’ll need to match the IO to what we have chosen. You can verify all that from the schematics. If you want to tweak our install you’re welcome to do that as well. The homing scripts are written as Centroid macros that are easy to edit. ---
**Author:** ![rockstarsmurf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b487fb/32.png) [@rockstarsmurf](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/rockstarsmurf)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 8:08pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/10 "2025-03-31T20:08:04Z")
> [@Eric](#): > > We use the single relay method as well for squaring. We have a special homing script that differs from the Centroid stock one in a lot of ways. Not only does it do squaring, but it detects your machine type and will set different things (And home differently) depending on your machine settings. > > If you want to run our software on your retrofit you are welcome to do it, but for our software to work properly you’ll need to match the IO to what we have chosen. You can verify all that from the schematics. Thank you so much for your response. I have been going through AVID’s published schematics very carefully this weekend as well as cross referncing them with Centroid’s Schematic #S15200 which are _almos_t identical. ([https://www.centroidcnc.com/dealersupport/schematics/uploads/S15200.r4.pdf](https://www.centroidcnc.com/dealersupport/schematics/uploads/S15200.r4.pdf)) One thing that I don’t understand is the wiring and operation for the relay autosqauring. I understand the concept but the way the wires are hooked up seems counterintuitive to how the Centroid auto squaring routine is discribed as working. Both Centroid and Avid show hooking up Y2 Pulse(-) to COM and Y1 Pulse(-) to NC at Relay #8. ![image](https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/flex027/uploads/avidcnc/original/2X/0/066b05f26da3cbbc8957e1908a44042bb25011bb.png) ![image](https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/flex027/uploads/avidcnc/original/2X/a/aed342bef00791b52f139c0bc24d206eb0d56503.png) My understanding of the signal flow is as follows: 1. The signal for DIRECTION 2 comes _FROM_ Pin 5 of the DB 25 terminal on the ACORN board and is sent _TO_ the DIR (-) terminal of both Y1 & Y2 stepper drivers (I believe Avid’s new interconnect board includes some signal inversion magic as well…) 2. The signal for STEP 2 comes _FROM_ Pin 4 of the DB 25 terminal on the ACORN board and is sent _TO_ the PUL (-) terminal on the Y2 Stepper Driver _AND_ the COM terminal on Relay #8. 3. The signal for STEP 2 comes _FROM_ the NC terminal on the Relay #8 ACORN board and is sent _TO_ the PUL (-) terminal on the Y1 Stepper Driver. 4. If the relay is closed, both Y1 and Y2 are recieving the same STEP 2 signal and are “paired”. 5. If the relay is open, Y2 is still recieving the STEP 2 signal but Y1 is “unpaired”. 6. Centroid’s standard homing routine is to seek home for Y2 and then decouple (by opening the relay I assume…) and then seeks home for Y1. What I don’t understand (and what is driving me CRAZY!!!) is shouldn’t it be the other way around? First home the master axis, then dissconnect and continue homing the slave axis…? Becuase if the STEP 2 signal is coming throug COM and out NC, opening the relay would interupt that. You would still have control of Y2 but you are cut off from Y1. Am I looking the signal flow backwards? What am I missing? ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex027/user_avatar/forum.avidcnc.com/eric/32/3220_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 8:17pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/11 "2025-03-31T20:17:40Z")
I’m not sure why Centroid shows it that way… It’s really simple: Just cut the step pulse off to one of the Y motors by way of a relay. You want that step pulse to go through the relay when it’s NC, and that’s really it. The trickier part is the homing logic… you have to account potentially a random Y sensor hitting first, and how you handle that. So let’s say you cut the signal for Y1, but Y2 hits first you need to “crabwalk” the gantry into square. If Y1 hits first that’s easier, you just cut of iff there and keep moving Y2 until it hits. ---
**Author:** ![rockstarsmurf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b487fb/32.png) [@rockstarsmurf](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/rockstarsmurf)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 9:10pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/12 "2025-03-31T21:10:08Z")
> [@Eric](#): > > I’m not sure why Centroid shows it that way… It’s really simple: Just cut the step pulse off to one of the Y motors by way of a relay. > > You want that step pulse to go through the relay when it’s NC, and that’s really it. Ok, so I’m not crazy for calling that out as weird, that’s good. > [@Eric](#): > > The trickier part is the homing logic… you have to account potentially a random Y sensor hitting first, and how you handle that. I guess that’s why Centroid suggest offseting the 2 sensor flags slightly to insure that one always hits before the other (unless things are really out of wack…) Either way is, as long as match my I/O to the AVID shematic I should be compatible with their version of CNC 12? One other thing, will avid sell their tool setter à la carte? Thank you so much for your feedback! ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex027/user_avatar/forum.avidcnc.com/eric/32/3220_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 10:33pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/13 "2025-03-31T22:33:43Z")
> [@rockstarsmurf](#): > > I guess that’s why Centroid suggest offseting the 2 sensor flags slightly to insure that one always hits before the other (unless things are really out of wack…) If you have the inputs it’s certainly an easier way to do it, but you can do it like we do with just one relay. > [@rockstarsmurf](#): > > Either way is, as long as match my I/O to the AVID shematic I should be compatible with their > version of CNC 12? It **should** be. We’ve done a lot of custom macros and such to make this all work together. As you’ve discovered it’s all open for you to see, the schematics are there and all of the things you need to tweak like homing macros and such are available for you to look at and edit if need be. The beauty here is that you can match our IO (or as close as you can get it) and use our software and change any settings that you need (we leave ALL of the Centroid stock stuff intact) or you can start with “stock” CNC12 and pull in our tweaks if you want. I suspect the way you’re heading the former will be the best strategy for you. > [@rockstarsmurf](#): > > One other thing, will avid sell their tool setter à la carte? Probably.. contact support and ask 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![rockstarsmurf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b487fb/32.png) [@rockstarsmurf](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/rockstarsmurf)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 10:51pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/14 "2025-03-31T22:51:11Z")
Thank you so much for being willing to educate and inform on top of AVID being so transparent with all their schematics. Alot of companies will say they want to support their customers but actions speak louder then words. Your willingnes to answer my questions proves that AVID is here to support past customers as well as new ones. ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex027/user_avatar/forum.avidcnc.com/eric/32/3220_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2025, 12:28pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/15 "2025-04-01T12:28:15Z")
No problem! This stuff is a bit of extra work on our part, but we’re happy to do it. We love seeing folks adapt our machines for all kinds of interesting use cases. ---
**Author:** ![buckybadger9](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@buckybadger9](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/buckybadger9)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2025, 2:39am UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/16 "2025-04-02T02:39:03Z")
Thanks for the explanation. One issue I’ve been chasing is that when re-engaging the Y2 stepper, it jumps, maybe 0.01" which throws off the squaring regardless of which sensor is tripped first. It looks pretty consistent but not 100%, is there a squaring strategy that can work around this? Best I’ve come up with is Y2 hits first, disable Y2, move Y1 to flag then move 0.01" to match what the Y2 jump might be, reactivate Y2, then iterate until they both hit simultaneously. Or am I overthinking this? ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex027/user_avatar/forum.avidcnc.com/eric/32/3220_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2025, 12:35pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/17 "2025-04-02T12:35:44Z")
Is this happening on our box or a custom box? ---
**Author:** ![rockstarsmurf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b487fb/32.png) [@rockstarsmurf](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/rockstarsmurf)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2025, 7:05pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/18 "2025-04-02T19:05:37Z")
> [@Eric](#): > > Probably.. contact support and ask 🙂 Looks like that’s a NO on buying a just the tool setter from AVID. Oh well. ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz1.discourse-cdn.com/flex027/user_avatar/forum.avidcnc.com/eric/32/3220_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2025, 7:34pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/19 "2025-04-02T19:34:40Z")
I ran one of these for a long time: > **[RATTMMOTOR Normally Open Mach3 CNC Automatic Tool Sensor Gauge Changer CNC Z...](https://www.amazon.com/RATTMMOTOR-Automatic-Normally-Setting-Engraving/dp/B08LK93NTC)** > > RATTMMOTOR Normally Open Mach3 CNC Automatic Tool Sensor Gauge Changer CNC Z Axis Probe Tool Touch Sensor Setter Setting 4 Wires for CNC Router Engraver Machine - Amazon.com They work great, and can wire right in. Just get yourself a field wireable M12 A coded adapter (Male) ---
**Author:** ![buckybadger9](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@buckybadger9](https://forum.avidcnc.com/u/buckybadger9)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2025, 9:47pm UTC](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417/20 "2025-04-02T21:47:24Z")
Custom box - Leadshine closed-loop steppers (pre EX announcement, wish I would have known)… [Next page](https://forum.avidcnc.com/t/cnc12-v5-22-auto-squaring/4417.md?page=2)